November 07, 2007 - Msg 57847: Wow. Good advice, New Neighor. You are so right. If you remove everything from their reach, they never learn to leave things alone. Certainly, a priceless heirloom shouldn't be at risk, but children are capable of learning, and MW, yours learned that when you disobey, bad things happen.

My husband used to say that we should model our child-rearing principles on the way God deals with us. For example, He doesn't remove all danger from the world. AIDS exists, etc. However, He gives us rules to follow, and when we do, we generally fare pretty well. Disobey, and there are usually consequences. Also, children must learn that life is not always fair, because it's not. Sometimes another kid has a better toy, or nicer clothes, or is prettier. That's life, but God will level the field in Heaven, if we follow Him there.

Well, that's my two cents' worth. At the moment, my toes are being nibbled by some very sharp little teeth, so I think someone wants attention. She just ate her breakfast, ALL of it! I'm so glad, because she ate very little last night. I think I'll take her over and get her established with Dr. Mike today. She's current on all immunizations, but I want her first visit to be a pleasant, non-invasive one. Then we'll go to PetsMart and get her something. Toys, she doesn't need. I got her three last week, the breeder sent her home with two more, and I've decided that it's okay for her to have Sugarplum's toys. I had thought to just put them away, but decided that would be foolish. Sugar had a toy box, with about twenty little toys, so I guess Starr will inherit that. So, no toys are needed. Besides, she'll get toys for Christmas, from my kids. Yes, we give little gifts to our pets. My granddogs all get a gift from me. What can I say??

Starr says 10-4. --Romeena
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57848: I just have to say again how much I appreciate all the kind comments regarding Starr. You folks all recognize how important Sugarplum was to me, and now you're helping me make the transition to a different life with another little companion. It's really a gift to have friends who understand, and who join in the process. Thanks, all. --Romeena
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57849: Good morning porch family. Thanks for the APB for me Me-They. I have been busy this week and not much time to rock. It is good to me missed.
A big Tennessee welcome to STARR! Congratulations Romeena, I am happy you are not alone at home now. I enjoy hearing about her so talk away. It has been colder here the past few days.. supposed to be in the upper 20's tonight.
My son has a football game Friday night so I imagine we will have to dress warm for that. It is a playoff game so wish them luck for us. Just the usual stuff going on with me, which is a good thing for me. Ya'll take care and thanks for lunch MW. Prayers and blessings to all. Big Maude
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57850: HI everyone--I was wondering what you all would think of this--I know there are alot of christians here and I am on shakey ground as far as my faith is conserned right now.

How do you account for people who do the following.
I heard a story on the news the other day about a church who are against the Iraq war.
Some of them picketed the funerl of a local boy who was killed over there with signs that said--"Thank God for Dead Soldiers" and Other words to the effect that the war was God's punishment for H***S******. The parents of the boy brought a lawsuit agianst the church and they responded-the church I mean by saying they were being percuted for the Lord.
This is not the only cruel and insenstive thing I have seen done in the name of God.
I am not trying to start trouble--I just want to know what you think
Ahappynut
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57851: Do you God is punishament people who have aids or cans.
God did not worke that way.

Dr Pat
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57852: DR Pat--I guess God is not supposed to work that way--but over the years I have seen too much meaness in the church--not that I have not met some wonderful people---The church family that I raised my daughter in was more like family than my blood kin. It's just befor that and since.
Ahappynut
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57853: AHAPPYNUT: The Westboro Baptist "church" of which you speak has been in the news a lot in the last few years. They are an independent cult--I mean church--who go around doing vile things like this in their anti-homos*xual agenda. They feel that the U.S. is the modern Sodom-Gomorrah. In most Christian opinions, they are not Christian and barely qualify as people.

Unfortunately, tehre are those who twist Scripture to fit their own agenda. The Lord said that many will come in His name but not really be so. That's why our faith has to be supported with our intelligence as well as our emotions and spirit. God gave us a brian for discernment. These people don't represent Christ on earth, even if they say they do.

Have a great day.

Me-They
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57854: Well, he may have given us a Brian, but also a brain. My sad typing skills...

M-T
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57855: GOD may the world and us to.
But some of us had trut away from thim and had start was all the bad thing today.

Dr.Pat
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57856: Where did the rihgt of h***s****** go.
We all have the right to live the way we want and you do not like it say something to thim.
Wined it cometime for thimsee fact God will be one what all the qus and juist not us here and now.

TOM

November 07, 2007 - Msg 57857:
Barney: Both my mother and I dont like people messing with our hats.
Andy: (Grinning) I'm just trying to picture you and your mother sittin' around with your hats pulled over yer ears.

back later, MDC
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57858:
Hey Folks

Merri-Yes, I do consider myself a liberal, in the same vain that Adams, Jefferson, and Hamilton were liberal. As for today's use of the term Liberal, as in Marx, Clinton, and Chomsky, well, that's a different animal. I have always believed that there is a world of difference between "Liberal" and "liberal." Sorry about bringing on that early Christmas feeling. If it's any help we'll be swimming in mud for a while when this stuff melts tomorrow.

Ahappynut-No trouble here. But, I think you can compare these people speaking for God to the person who steals a credit card, then uses it, speaking for the owner of the card.

Romeena-What makes you happy makes us happy! Starr appears to fit like a nice comfy glove.

auh2o
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57859: wow so greAT SEEING ALL THE OLD FRIENDS AGAIN. SINCE I'M AT WORK I CAN ONLY SNEAK A MESSEAGE OUT NOW AND THEN. JUST REMEMBER EACH OF YOUR ARE IN MY THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS. MDC- SOMETHING IN THE MAIL FOR YOU. OUT OF ALL OF BARNEYS GIRLFREINDS WHICH WOULD YOU HAVE CHOOSEN FOR HIM TO MARRY? ALSO HOW DO YOU THINK THE SHOW IF IN THE 5TH SEASON. 9IF BARNEY WOULD HAVE GOTTEN MARRIED? happy turkey day if I DON'T GET BACK ON BEFORE HAND, AS FAR AS POLITICAL RACES I BACK ANDY 100% FOR PRESIDENT. JUST THE OLD PAPPA BEAR
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57860:
"Hmmm, I'll have to ask Johnny Paul Jason about this."
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57861: I think JOhnny Paul would have said Thelma Lou.
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57862:
MDC, you are 100% right in my book! It's never a bad time, nor the kids too young, to issue an apology. They understand. Great point! They DO understand, and it'll set an example for them and teach them to not be too proud to apologize when they feel they're wrong.

I don't wanna start a big ol' "spare the rod and spoil the child" moulage, but I just wanna say that yellin', bad as it is, is better than whackin', imho. When you DO resort to a fanny-smackin', it carries a lot more clout when it's done almost never, or at least very infrequently. When I was coming up, I could expect a whippin' on a regular basis. It lost its meaning and left me feeling lower than a sow's belly. And that's what I got to say about that.

Ro', WELCOME, STARR! I'm so excited for you! You hit the nail on the head as usual with your comments about consequences. There's only one way to stay out of trouble, and that's to keep your nose clean. Period.

Dr. Pat, do I think AIDS is 'punishment' for 'bad' behavior? Of course not. No more than walking up to a person with the flu and kissing them smack on the mouth. Some folks tie illness up with religion and punishment, but in the end, I believe it's just good ol' common sense.

Love to all on this beautiful day!

~DeS~ (still being lazy in black and white :-)




November 07, 2007 - Msg 57863: ~DeS~ so in your book it o k for h***s****** to be that way and not git punishment by God for the wrong you do

Dr.PAT
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57864:
Ro, meant to ask, did your skin condition clear up? Looks like mine is folliculitis, but it's almost cleared up.
Racing getting closer to GO time here in Phx this week, but weather is still in the low 90's !!
Hey DES, just aint the same without the squiggle! ha
Auh20- have you read anything on Ron Paul?
MT_ sometimes mu brain feels more like a brian! ha
God to see pappa bear getting BOLDer in his posts! :)
Welcome Starr!
Prayers for yall!
MDC
Otis: I'll call my attorney and he'll have me IN there just like that!
We want winter!!!
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57865: How sad for you, DES. I'm sorry you got spanked regularly.

AHappyNut, instead of letting people like Phelps and his Westboro church discourage you, you might try to focus on the many godly people of ages past (and now) who loved God and people...there are alot of them out there. Try doing a google search on Heros of the Christian Faith.

Guess what happened to me today?! I was walking to the mailbox and right in the ditch near the sewer drain was the most adorable little bunny rabbit. We are right in the middle of town so I knew it had to be someone's pet. It looks like it is still very young and is black and white with big, shiny black eyes. When I tried to go up to it, it ran into the drain at first but when I sat down in the grass, it didn't take long for it to come out and let me pick it up. It didn't fight or scratch and didn't seem to mind being held. My neighbor had a cage so I put him in it and fed him, then Sean and I started around the neighborhood to see if anyone is missing a pet. So far, nothing, so I may have added a new member to the family. It sure is cute!

Better go, have to take a load of kids to a youth event tonight...sigh.

Boo
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57866:
Not sure why my winter comment was at the end. I typed it after the low 90's!! hmmmm MDC
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57867:
Sorry boo, didnt see ya there.
MDC
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57868:
Yep, Boo, but it made me a better parent. No one knows why some kids who were spanked (and I use the term generously) regularly grow up compassionate and some turn out mean. Some kids who never had a hand laid on them turn out mean, too. Beyond extreme examples, I don't see much rhyme or reason. All I knew is, I didn't want my kids feeling like I used to. I don't mean to imply I was abused; I don't consider myself in that light at all -- but I sure got the hairbrush, the open hand, and even a belt a time or three. It's ok, though. I might have been screwed up, but it afforded me the wisdom to make sure my kids never felt the way I used to.

Dr. Pat, I'm convinced that some folks are born what they are. Have you ever seen hermaphrodites? Those folks were born with physical anomalies that confuse their physical identities. It only stands to reason that there are those with psychological issues which confuse their s----- identities. Perhaps some h--- s-----s are 'made,' -- I don't know -- but I do know that h---s----lity occurs in nature with roughly the same frequency as it does in humans. Take that however you wish. I understand that's moulage fodder, but I'll take my lumps and live with the fallout. ("It's the fallout.") As it pertains to CONSENTING ADULTS (those two words say it all, imho), I'll leave the judging to God.

~DeS~
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57869: ~DeS~ he is playing judg on people for thing .
How min of his people are H***S****** and just not saying a thing about it

Dr.Pat
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57870: Dr. Pat, my answer to your question in #57863 is very simple. It's God's business, not mine. I do believe that God considers h/s behavior to be wrong - the Bible says so, but it also says not to lie, cheat, gossip, or do a lot of things that everyone does at some time or other. None of us are sinless, which is precisely why Jesus came and died. Mankind is determined to make "degrees of sin" (one sin is worse than another, etc.) but to God, sin is sin, period. How, or when, or if God chooses to punish someone's sin is strictly up to Him, and He doesn't need my help. Most sins carry consequences, so most of the time God doesn't need to punish, we punish ourselves. The man who wastes his money on alcohol, depriving his family of the necessities of life, will suffer consequences. He'll likely lose the love and respect of those he loves, and he'll probably die with cirrhosis or some such, the result of excessive alcohol. The h/s who engages in deviant behavior may very well contract AIDS or some other disease, and that's a consequence of his behavior. I don't view that as a punishment from God - it's just the natural course of things. We reap what we sow. If you have a row of dominoes standing up, and you push one over, they'll all eventually fall. It's just natural law.

Does that answer your question? Blessings! --Romeena
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57871:
Wise words, Ro. Some of the most precious and loving people in my life have been gay, and even more so have been straight. There are a multitude of sins which will get us into trouble if not atoned for.

When will we see pics of your adorable Starr, Ro?

~DeS~


November 07, 2007 - Msg 57872: To a happy nut, you got some good answers. I'd like to submit this scripture:

Not every one that saith unto Me, "Lord, Lord", shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of My Father which is in heaven.

Many will say to Me, in that day, "Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Thy name? and in Thy name have cast out devils? and in Thy name done many wonderful works?"

And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity. (Matthew 7:21-23)

In my opinion, and it is only that, old Phelps and his self-righteous thugs are going to be very shocked when those words are said to them.

The Bible says we (Christians) will be known by the fruit we bear, and goes on to name the fruits: love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness and temperance. I can't say that any one of those could be applied to that "church" and their activities.

However, their behavior has caused you to question, and I'm sure you're not alone. The Bible is not silent on that subject either, stating that it is better for a man that a millstone be hanged about his neck and he be cast into the depth of the sea, than for him to cause one of these little ones (a seeker) to stumble.

Phelps and many others who take the name of Christian and then do horrible things "in God's name" are not Christians. I'm not judging, not personally. I'm simply comparing them to the standards God established, and they don't fit. I pity them, because they have deluded themselves, and they're risking eternal punishment by their behavior. God does not take kindly to being credited with the authorship of such behavior.

To put it simply - the cat can have kittens in the oven, but that doesn't mean they're biscuits. People can call themselves Christian, but if their behavior doesn't mirror Christ's love, then they have taken His name in vain. God have mercy on them.

Blessings! --Romeena
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57873: Boo- What a picture,-- you sitting along the road in a ditch, looking in a drain pipe. Poor Boo. Did cars go by and wonder what in the world?
The Lord allowed me to have one of the most memorable days with my father. We went back to his home farm and town, rode around to visit folks there and family left in the area. (would you believe the name of the town is Mt. Airy- not in N.C.) What a blessing today was!! (Mostly for me)but I suspect for him too. It's the little things that mean the most. Lovingly ~New Neighbor
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57874:
Hello porch family....Good to see you all today.

auh2o, NN, MW....thanks for the kind words.

Boo...glad you got some rest. Also, I've said it before but it just blesses my heart to hear what God is doing with those young girls through your obedience.

M-T...hope you didn't work too hard today. Don't get too busy.

Ro.... Starr sure sounds like she's a....well, a "star."

Ahappynut....as for the Westboro Baptist "church", I agree with M-T and Ro on this group. They are certainly not CHRISTians.

MDC....keep those race fans straight out there.

Spot...hey brother....man sounds like you keep putting those miles on that bike. You have a road bike, mountain bike or what?

Well gotta go...You all have a good night and remember, Jesus loves us even when we fail.
Prayers for all the porch family.
-REV.
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57875: Well, Boo, congratulations on your new pet. A rabbit makes a very fine pet. Did you know they can be trained to use a litterbox? Possibly your little bunny is already trained. He sounds like he's definitely been somebody's pet. First of all, wild rabbits are not black and white, and second, there's no way on earth you could have just picked up a wild one. Nope, that's a pet, and if he's not claimed, I hope you give him a home and just enjoy the daylights out of him.

We had a pet rabbit for a few years when our kids were little - Rab had the run of the house! He was more fun, and sure did draw some long looks from first-time visitors. My husband got a lot of mileage out of it. Rab would always hide at first when visitors came, and after a little while, he'd come creeping into the room - yes, rabbits can creep. They stretch themselves out very long on their front legs, then give a slow, controlled hop to bring the back legs forward. This makes sort of a slow, rocking-horse gait. Visitors would pause in mid-sentence and stare at the big white rabbit just rock-hopping into the room. My husband, the weasel, would continue as though he noticed nothing unusual, and would ignore Rab completely.

Rab would hop up onto the seat of the sofa, then onto the back and would do his concertina crawl along the top of the sofa until he reached the nearest shoulders. He would then proceed to drape himself around the neck of his victim, casual as could be, and just hang there, like a fur piece. All the while eyebrows rose higher and higher, jaws dropped, and my husband just continued to talk, no acknowledgement of the rabbit at all! He had a mean streak, that man. It was a riot!

Anyway, I highly recommend a rabbit as a housepet.

Starr says 10-4. --Romeena
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57876: Well good evening porch, been busy today and at work now..Rev I had one of those [still do] mt bikes and took it on the silver comet trail [yall check out the web page] but only once...12 or 15 miles on those nobby tires NOPE..bought me a nice road bike 21 speed, fat seat...ya know comfort..Romeena we will never get tired of Starr news!..us dogs like to be talked about...hey Big maude,boo,Tom,mdc,m-t,auh20,nn,merri,lucy,hazel,des,dr.p,ahn,possum and all I have missed..pappa,Asa and all...well let me get settled in here at work watched the CMA awards they were good...that George Strait is a class act...well is there any leftovers from supper?...belly growling [or is that Starr?}..prayers...SPOT
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57877: Will someoneadd a long on the fire it gitting to git cold, AND ARTHRITIS IS ACTTING UP FROM ALL IS COLD.

TOM

November 07, 2007 - Msg 57878: Oh, Tom, I'm sorry you're having trouble with arthritis. That surely can be painful. And you're so right, cold weather just makes it worse. Do you have one of those grain bag things that you heat in the microwave? They're helpful. If not, a hot water bottle helps some, too. Anything to warm up an aching joint.

I have a form of arthritis that moves around. One day it will be in my knees or hips, and the next it gets into my wrists, or sometimes my lower back. That's the one I dread the most, when it gets in my back. Little Sugarplum always seemed to sense when that was the case, and would leave her preferred sleeping spot, and cuddle against my back, right where it hurt. Her little body was always so warm, it really helped. I guess time will tell whether Starr has those sensitivities or not. She's much too little to know anything right now, she's just a little bubblehead. A cute little bubblehead, though.

Blessings, and prayers for your arthritis, Tom. --Romeena
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57879: Wow, that's pretty amazing, Ro. That little Sugarplum was a very special pup.

Loved the story about Rab. That is really a hoot...I can just picture that scene in my mind and am wondering how your dear husband kept a straight face! I don't know about keeping this bunny. We will probably be trying to find it another good home. The way things are now, here in this apartment, it probably wouldn't work out, but I'm curious, how do you train a rabbit to use a litter box?

Thanks for pitying me, New Neighbor! ha....one guy stopped to get his mail and I asked him if the rabbit was his, but other than that, only very sweet next-door neighbor witnessed the event and she was helping me by providing a cage for me to use.

Thank you for your encouraging words, REV. I feel like I am a very small part of things, really. It's God's work and I am kind of along for the ride, so to speak. In fact, my friend Keith has been doing most of the teaching lately, which has given me a break. I am still there every Tuesday for support and to love and pray for the girls, but I am letting Keith share from God's word with them most of the time (just for now, though, I think...we'll see what God has planned).

DES, I remember seeing a program on Learning channel a few years ago about people who grow up to have "gender crisis" and it turns out that the reason for it was that they were born with both male and female parts. Not hermaphrodites, exactly because it was not something that could be seen outwardly. For instance, a person was interviewed who appeared to be a normal boy at birth but also had many feminine tendencies (always felt like a girl, etc). Also had attraction to boys. Well, it turns out after testing, he had ovaries inside that nobody knew about. When chromosomal testing was done, he was determined to actually be a girl. Now, this is a rare occurance but might explain a small percentage of those who are gay. By the way, I have heard the argument about animals being gay in nature, and I heard recently that it was refuted. Just something I was thinking...

Off to bed...I'm beat to the sox!
November 07, 2007 - Msg 57880: sorry...that was me, Boo.
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57881: Morning Gang..breakfast menu: eggs your way,center cut country ham,hashbrowns,fried apple rings,bacon,bisquits and gravy,toast,grape jelly,coffee,oj,h20,milk and a tear from my roll of paper towels...well its home at 6 for me and sleep and back at 2 for 16...prayers...SPOT
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57882: Mornin' y'all-breakfast sounds great,spot! What would we do without our cookin' canine of the Porch?! Speaking of canines,I want to wish Starr & Romeena(I ain't calling YOU a canine,Ro!) many happy moments with each other-congrats on the new addition,Ro!

Several years back,we had a huge black & white rabbit in our yard all the time.Mr.Possum said it had to have been someone's pet at one time-not a wild bunny.Anyway,it got accustomed to us being around and actually let us touch it and my nieces & nephews fed it Cheetos once! I kept hoping that it would be around for my grandchild to see,but it disappeared not long before Laci was born.I managed to get a picture of it though and was sort of sad it went away,because I think some critter got it.We do get lots of wild brown rabbits in the yard,but that black & white one was special.Boo,if you don't keep the one you found,send it to me!

Tom,hope your arthritis eases up and you feel better.

Y'all have a nice day!
*****SMILES*****
possum under a rock
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57883:
Morning Folks

MDC-I like Ron Paul, a lot, he's a bit more libertarian than I prefer but I do like him. What is your take on him?

Spot-I cannot tell ya how good that breakfast sounds, I'll take a coffee as black as the night, please. And, maybe, two tears off that towel, I'm hungry.

Anyone see the speech by French President Nicolas Sarkozy the other day? Wow, wow, wow, it was very nice.
Sarkozy: "I want to tell you that whenever an American soldier falls somewhere in the world, I think of what the American army did for France."

auh2o
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57884:
Here's another quote from Sarkozy,

"To the millions of men and women who came from every country of the world and who -- with their own hands, their intelligence, and their hearts -- built the greatest nation in the world, America did not say, "Come, and everything will be given to you." Rather, she said, "Come, and the only limits to what you will be able to achieve will be those of your own courage, your boldness, and your talent."

I won't bug you with any more of those but I just loved it!

auh2o
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57885: Nice quotes, auh2o. Looks like France finally has a President who knows what is what, and isn't afraid to say it.

You hit the nail on the head there, Ro, "RARE occurance". Certainly not the multitude who claim to be "born that way" today. Nature doesn't make that many mistakes. And who knows why God makes that happen, if indeed he does. With all the chemicals and other things we absorb into our bodies, you have to expect some adverse effects. Sorry if that opinion offends any of you.

Well friends, I have my interview for the library job today. As it happens, I got to pick the time I wanted to come in for it, so I picked the top spot. The first time slot. I learned in school that it was better to get things you are nervous about(like giving speeches) over with, so I would always raise my hand to go first. Then I could breath a sigh of relief when it was over and just relax, while the other people sweated until their turn.
I am nervous about this one. For one, I really want the job; and two, you have to interview at city hall in the council chambers in front of the library board, and I don't even know how many are on the board. I hate interviews like that, in front of a committee. Prayers for my nerves, are appreciated. ;)

-Sterling Holobyte


November 08, 2007 - Msg 57886:
I miss my squiggle, too, MDC. Internet Explorer lets me do it, but Firefox won't. Oh well.

Hey back at ya, Spot! What you gonna rustle up for us to eat this morning?

My friend had a pet rabbit. She'd drive up from work and the rabbit would be lined up on the back of the couch in front of the window waiting for her. Oh, with a dog on one side and a cat on another. LOL What a hoot. The rabbit was litter box trained and was just the greatest pet.

A good Mayberry morning to all! Now I must get to work. I won't bore you with my current project, but I can tell you it involves a brush and colorful stuff in a can. hahaha

~DeS~


November 08, 2007 - Msg 57887: Prayers for your job interview, Sterling. I am really hoping for the best.

Wish you lived close enough to come get this bunny, Possum. I think I may have found someone who wants him.

More later...

Boo
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57888: Oh No!! DES is painting again...please do it in a well-ventilated area this time...

Boo
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57889: Good morning everyone. We actually had a killing frost last night. I even had to scrape my windshield this morning.

It’s been one moulage after another lately. What strikes me is how civil and friendly we keep our moulages here. We may disagree, but at the end of the day we’re still friends. My kinda town.

Now, since I’m not one to let a good moulage go by without sticking my foot in it…I do not believe that being homos*xual is a sin. Whether it’s nature or nurture that causes it I don’t know, but I do believe that people can’t help being who they are. However, the Bible does makes it pretty clear that engaging in homos*xual behavior is a sin. Whether or not you think the Bible makes it expressly clear or not, it is clear that God expects us to reserve intimate relations for marriage. And marriage is not a piece of paper from the state—such things weren’t even necessary in the U.S. until the mid-19th century, as it was perfectly legal to get married through banns, stating such in an official church document. A marriage is a man and a woman coming together in a covenant with God.

Life isn’t fair. It’s sad, but true. Good people die, bad people get rich. Homos*xuals, since they can’t fulfill God’s plan for marriage, cannot experience intimacy without sinning any more that an unmarried man and woman can. People are born, or acquire, all sorts of afflictions and things that become their burden to bear. Heck, in some form or other, we all have a cross (or three) to bear. Unfortunately, this is the homos*xual’s. I believe we should treat people of any stripe with the dignity, love, kindness, and mercy that we are commanded to by God. ROMEENA’s right: we all sin. That does not mean, however, that we must accept sin as okay. It is not.

The Bible also tells us that those of us who bear our crosses well and allow God to carry us through adversity will be richly rewarded. That is even truer for those who suffer more here on earth. At least that’s how I see it.

BOO: We raised rabbits when I was a kid. I loved playing with them. Eating them, not so much.

Prayers, STERLING! I hope that you get the job.

Y’all have a great day.

Me-They
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57890: Wow, I think you said that better than anyone I have ever heard, Me-They.

Boo
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57891: M-T, you're a real beacon of light here on the porch and I appreciate you. My closest buddy, since I was 15 years old, is gay. He asked me one day when we were discussing the "born this way" issue; he asked "would anyone in their right mind CHOOSE THIS LIFE? Being ostracized, judged, looked down upon, regarded with disgust, not able to marry or have children?" And then very astutely, he asked me "did you choose to be heterosexual?" I finally understood. And if God allows or creates people with mixed genders, isn't also possible that gay people can be born that way as well? It's all about how the brain is hard-wired. We know so little about the brain. I can't in good conscience look down upon someone who can't help being what they are. God loves them all the same. And so do I. I wonder how many people who weren't virgins when they married judge gay people harshly? We will all have to answer for our transgressions eventually.

Well, anyway--GOOD MORNING everybody! I hope today finds all of you happy and healthy!

DeS, paint on my friend. Let us know how this project ends up.

STERLING, good luck! Let us know how it all turns out.

AUH2O, I don't think we've been this cozy with a French leader since we were given the "Statue de la Liberté!" I wonder how the French people are handling all this Pro-American stuff. This guy is slick (I mean that in a good way)...he air-kissed Laura Bush's hand. Looks like he's going through a nasty divorce, though.

Well, have you heard the news? Gas has officially hit $5 per gallon in California somewhere around Big Sur. And today, Congress was warned that the economy is heading south. Oh, do you think so? Gee, that writing hasn't been on the wall for months. We've got working families with children who are having to cut their grocery bills in half in order to pay for their gas. Sorry, am I being a stick in the mud? I don't mean to be--hope I'm not starting another moulage. We're moulaging all over this place!

Have a great afternoon everyone! Blessings all around--MW

November 08, 2007 - Msg 57892: Well gas is going to go way high if we do not stop it.
The big oil comp want to hold us up about rish gas up.

Dr.Pat
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57893:
Merri-I think the French populace are fine with it. They just elected Sarkozy and he ran on a decidedly Pro-American platform. I'm sorry you don't feel good about the country's future. I must say, I can't really to that. As for the economy, this might cheer you up, it grew 4% last quarter after growing 4% the previous quarter and I believe over 300,000 jobs were created over that period. The economy has been growing for sometime. When this was happening during the mid 90's it was compared to the roaring 20's. And, it was reported over and over and over. It's funny that during this administration you don't see the coverage.

Sterling-Good luck on the interview!

auh2o
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57894: No doubt there are some bright spots in the gloomy forecast but there are still some things to be concerned about, in my humble opinion AUH20. With gas being at an all-time historical high, it will undoubtedly have a slowing effect on the country. We've already seen some of the repercussions in the housing industry with yet another historical rate of foreclosures. People are losing their homes because they can't afford to pay their bills or they've bought too much house when the economy was looking good and now can't ante-up. Grocery prices are at least 25% higher due to the gas hike. As usual, the rich will still be rich and the poor will still have their life line. It's the middle working class that suffers. I guess that holds true no matter who is in office. I remember not too long ago, the History channel had some kind of docu-drama painting a total collapse of our country when gas hit $8 per gallon. While that is speculation, it's still scary enough to cause some uneasiness--we're heading that direction (gas prices) unless something changes quickly. I'm hoping that people can afford to hear their homes this winter! As far as the good things not being covered, I wonder if that has anything to do with historical gas prices, foreclosures, the fall-out of the American dollar overseas, Iraq and the impending election? News is never known for it's positivity unfortunately. Anyway, some food for thought...

Well, ladies and gents, I've called in the big dog! I had to put a call out to Nana, the super-Granny! Yes folks, that's right. I concede. I lose the toddler wars. I am taking a break. My mom is coming over to have some one-on-one with gherkin #2. As I was brushing my teeth this morning, she opened the bottom drawer to my dresser and stepped in it tearing out the bottom. Sometimes I fantasize that I'm on Safari chasing a wild beast and as I'm parting the foliage, I raise my dart gun and POOF! I got the beast right on the hiney and to sleep she goes! Of course, I am completely joking but sometimes I have funny daydreams like that.

Lunch here today is kind a drab--canned soup and sliced apples. I'm needing some new recipes. The best recipes I have are from Church cookbooks. But I think I've used them all up.

RO, how's STARR today?

Alright folks, I better get back to things. See ya this evening! Love to all! MW


November 08, 2007 - Msg 57895: Thanks for the kind words. The only thing I'd add to you comments, MW, is that "nurture" (as opposed to nature) doesn't necessarily imply a choice. I have had a number of gay friends and co-workers over the years, too, and I can't but seem to find similarities in many of their lives. For instance, I have never known a gay man well who had a good relationship with his father, and a number never had a father or strong male figure in their young lives. Coincidence? I don't know. But I certainly wouldn't discount nurture yet; for all the genes they've been able to splice, all the dna strands they've disected, they haven't found a "gay" gene yet.

And I'm not sure now who talked about animals being homos*xual, but animals are neither homos*xual nor heterosexual. They do not possess s*xuality in the same terms as humans do. Their drive is based on instinct. While some animals may in fact experience pleasure of some sort, many (like cats, for instance) experience noteworthy pain. When two animals of the same s*x try to mate, we (science) see it as abnormal (unnatural). This is a poor rationalization for regarding homos*xual behavior in humans as acceptable, in my humble opinion. Of course, I am no biologist or psychologist. Heck, I don't even have a dog.

AUH2O: That Sarkizy seems like swell guy...for a frenchman ;).

Me-They
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57896: Oh, and I, for one, don't see high gas prices as a problem. In the short term, they are hurting my wallet pretty good. But for the long term, high gasoline prices are the only way we will pushed into really exploring alternative, cleaner fuels. We can't keep guzzling a nonrenewal, finite resource forever. It may last another 200 years, but teh sooner we get started the better for our kids' kids. Unfortunately, most of us are content to do what's easier in the short run unless it starts hurting the pocketbook. No pain, no gain.

M-T
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57897: Good afternoon, all. Sterling, I really hope you get that job. Prayers for you, my friend.

Me-They, I'll ditto Boo's statement. Your remarks were spot-on. We are all born with the proclivity to sin, one is tempted by this, one is tempted by that. I have several good friends who are gay - some practice the lifestyle, some do not. I also have straight friends who sin in other ways, just as I do. One of the "do nots" said one time that his celibacy was his gift to God. Just as Catholic priests and nuns remain celibate (I know, but let's not go there, most of them honor their vows) so does my friend. Pretty impressive, when you think about it. We have to remember - there is no sin in being tempted. Sin happens when one yields to temptation.

As for the physical gender confusion, I have seen this first-hand. Innocent little babies born, with the characteristics of both genders. The parents must make a decision and permit surgical revision, and can only hope they made the right choice. More recently, there are tests to help with the decision, but still, it's difficult. Life is not always easy.

Boo, you train a rabbit by making a litterbox available, and putting him in it frequently. They seem to have a natural attraction, particularly if you will moisten a paper towel in an "accident" and place it in the box beneath the litter. Rab was pretty good about it, but he did seem to enjoy filling one of my husband's shoes with pellets now and then. That went over about as well as you'd expect. As for Dale keeping a straight face during one of Rab's entrances, he was a master at that. He probably could have made a living playing poker if he had chosen to do so. He could be roaring with laughter on the inside, and never show a ripple outwardly. Eleven years, and I still miss that man!!

Blessings, friends. Starr says 10-4. --Romeena
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57898: Well, Merri, that is a good point. I do think, though, that sometimes people may have a certain attraction to the same s*x, for instance young people who experience same-s*x experimentation (which can be a common part of growing up) and because society and their schools are telling them that it's "okay to be gay", they accept it for fact, without realizing that they are too young to be classified as gay or straight yet. I am furious about the gay-activist groups who push this sort of thing in schools, when kids that age are just questioning their feelings and s*xuality. Think about how things were 50 years ago. Everyone knew of a gay person or two but the vast majority of people married, had families and are glad they did, I'm sure. I guess some of them had same-s*x attractions but chose something different...I do think it's a choice for most. I will admit that there are probably some with mental or physiological problems that have that to deal with, and your friend may be one of those unfortunate ones. While I have much compassion for people who struggle with their s*xuality, I cannot in good conscience tell them to live out their life in the way they feel is right for them when it so obviously contradicts the bible's teaching. The same as i would never say to one of my friends that it is ok to continue in any kind of destructive behavior. I still believe that Jesus is the answer and still believes that he gives power over sin. Does that mean that I won't struggle with it daily and sometimes fail? No, but I can't let sin be my master because I belong to another...make sense? As far as comparing animal behvior to human behavior, I think it is a dangerous thing to go there. Man, who is made in the image of God, has ability to choose, animals are a different story.

Speaking of animals, you will never believe what gross thing happened to me in the Walmart parking lot today. I was walking along and boom, I felt something wet hit my lips. When I reached up to wipe it, it was bird poop! Very smelly, orange bird poop. Ugh! I grabbed the hand sanitizer from my purse and luckily had an old Kleenix in the bottom of the purse, too. I slathered that sanitizer all over my lips, I tell ya! Horrible, but thought it might make someone smile and come up with a good punch line or something...

Boo
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57899: Hey there, Romeena, didn't see ya. You really made me smile with the pellet in the shoe thing. It reminded me of something one of my co-worker buddies and I did once on the night shift. We had nothing to keep us out of trouble and were pretty ticked off at a couple of the arrogant doctors we worked with. Well, we snuck into the doctor's lounge with tubes of Betadine ointment and filled their shoes with it! haha, it was great. Unfortunately, we weren't there to see the reaction but I can just imagine the cussing....Ah, fond memories...

Boo
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57900: Looks like a birdie had a boo-boo on BOO.

M-T
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57901: I understand the push for cleaner and more efficient fuels for the long haul and the better good, but I'm talking about A LOT of people who are on the fence financially, and gas prices are forcing them to not buy healthy, nutritious food for their kids or they're struggling to make their utility payments--well, that's a real problem for today. Personally, I've been using ethanol for the past year. I don't know if that's helping anything but I'm giving it a whirl.

Now about the gay nurture/nature issue, I can't say that both of those don't apply. I know my buddy came from a very stable, religious family. He had and still has a great relationship with his father. His parents have been married for 55 years and he's 1 of 4 boys. They're all college educated and have great jobs. It just so happens my friend is gay. I can't speak for anyone else. I do know that he's suffered a lot of abuse from the outside world and has even had his life threatened before. There had been a study done about the differences in gay people's brains, something about the hypothalamus maybe? It was remarkably different but can't remember how and I don't even know if it's been refuted at this point. I wonder if we'll ever have the answer in our lifetime. MW
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57902: MW, I'm so glad you came to the porch. You are an absolute delight! "POOF! Right on the hiney." I love it! I've seen my DIL point the TV remote at her kids and pretend she's turning them off, or at least muting them. I completely understand. And aren't you smart - no, wise (there's a difference) - to call in reinforcements, and it's so refreshing that you're willing to call your own mother. Good for you!

Well, I'm about to toss Starr in the car and head out on some errands, two of which involve her. The only place I can't take her is to the grocery store, and that's a problem, because the bloomin' store is four miles from me. I'll have to make that a special trip - now isn't that a pitiful waste of gasoline? Oh well. My car gets decent mileage - about 17-18 in town, and 24-25 on the highway. Gas is 2.95 here right now.

Starr says 10-4. --Romeena
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57903: Oh, hey gang! Sometimes these posts don't pop up until you post something...anyway, points well taken all around. I guess what I'm trying to say is that we can't put everybody's case in a box and stick a label on it. There are so many different factors and we just don't understand enough. That's all. And BOO, you're right--NO ONE should be pushing any se*uality in schools. I don't care if it's straight or gay. So sorry you got doo-dooed on. And what you nurses did to the doctors, well that's just a riot!

I'm just happy I'll get to shower today...mama please hurry! HA!! I'm really gone this time, I promise! MW
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57904: HEY RO! Ok, I'm a liar, but I can't resist saying hey to you and to say that I'm glad you're having fun with STARR. Hugs. MW
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57905: Yes, there is another grocery store about six blocks from me, but it's tiny, limited choices, higher prices, and it's FILTHY! The smell in the meat market area is disgusting. I will go in there occasionally, but only to buy something canned or bottled. Nothing fresh or perishable. I know there are people who don't have the luxury of a car or the funds to buy gas, who are forced to shop there, and that's sad. I wish there were better answers. --Romeena
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57906: MW: All significant changes are hard. After all, when we switched from the carriage to the horse-less one, many people (carriage makers, horsemen, liverymen, vets, etc.) had to find new ways to feed their families. Fortunately, many other jobs and situations were created. The same will happen this time. That may sound callous, but I don't mean it to be.It is sad that some have to make hard choices (I am one), but I'd rather have to make them then force my kids to later.

ROMEENA: About your extra trip in the car: I won't tell Al Gore, if you don't.

M-T
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57907: I've got some carbon off-sets I'm selling on e-Bay ;).

M-T
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57908: AUH2O: Didja hear that Pat Robertson endorsed Guliani yesterday? That's like a backhanded compliment, if I do say so. I'm not judging the guy's soul or aqnything, but he (Pat) is crazier than a bedbug.

Me-They
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57909: Sorry, it's me again.

Here's an invention every mom should love: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071106/ap_on_fe_st/odd_privy_prop.

M-T
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57910: man o man stop this world i want to git off.
all tis take about h***s***** is not a good thing for this little town.

Dr.Pat.

November 08, 2007 - Msg 57911: I wondered when someone was going to bring up Pat Robertson's endorsement of Rudy. I'm not the happiest about it. I do think we need to be strong against the terrorists and all that, but my moral convictions concerning abortion, gay marriage, etc.; will trump the terrorism card any day.

As far as the H* topic, well said in 57889, M-T.

Sorry to hear about your lip bomb episode, Boo! ; )

Prayers for all!
AFD
November 08, 2007 - Msg 57912:
Merri-Great discussion, love it. And, I'd like to second Romeena's post, it is great having you on the Porch. I must say though the price of gas and the trouble in the housing industry have little to do with each other. Most of the people who are forfeiting on their loans should never have taken a home loan out in the first place. The price of gas has much more to do with economic growth in other parts of the world than the effects of the American consumer. And, $8 per gallon gas would be scary but so would the boogie-man if it were true. I guess we can conjure up things to worry about but I just don't. The news coverage? Oh, I think there is very little doubt which way the press leans.

M-T I put very little stock in anything Pat Robertson has to say. When I said I could support a Guliani campaign, and I still could, that's taking into account that every one of the Democratic candidates are also pro-choice. I think Humphrey may have been the last one that wasn't. If that score equals out then you have to go to the next item on the agenda. Rudy absolutely wouldn't be my first pick.

Petro here is $3.35 this morning.

I gotta run, later friends.
auh2o